Episode 3.12 - Bell Thompson

Episode 12 brings in Bell Thompson, Philadelphia-based jazz trumpet player, and band leader!  We get to talk with Bell about her experience soloing with a variety of groups, getting into band leading, and her research focused on gender equity in jazz. 

Transcripts are available for every episode thanks to our team of interns!

To learn more about Bell, visit https://www.bellthompson.com/

Full Transcript

Carrie Blosser 0:00

Welcome to the third season of Diversify the Stand. Together, we speak with a wide range of musicians who talk about topics that are important to them. I'm Carrie Blosser.

Ashley Killam 0:08

And I'm Ashley Killam. We're so excited to dive into talks with a whole bunch of guests this season. If you like following along and are a fan of our podcast, please leave us a five star rating and review. Well, Bell, thank you so much for joining me today to chat a little bit about you.

Bell Thompson 0:23

Yeah, of course, this is really fun.

Ashley Killam 0:25

I would love to start off by hearing a little bit about you and your musical journey, kind of into where you currently are.

Bell Thompson 0:32

Yeah. Well, I'm originally from Seattle, Washington. And I started playing trumpet in fourth grade, I first started studying with my first teacher, Owuor Arunga, who's a Seattle trumpet player. And what first motivated me to sort of start practicing was trying to get into the Washington middle school jazz band. Yeah. So in my middle school, our director, Kelly Clingan. She was awesome. I really loved studying with her. And yeah, I auditioned for the middle school jazz band. And then I started playing jazz. And we started learning improvisation. And then I wanted to be part of the Garfield high school jazz band in Seattle. So I, I kept practicing. And then I started studying with Samantha Boshnack and Jay Thomas, who are also two great players in Seattle. Yeah, we started playing in the Garfield band, led by Clarence A. Cox. And that was a really big deal for me. Because I think I Garfield the history of the jazz band there is really has a really big reputation. So I was really excited to be a part of it. And it was really cool to like, be around so many other students that liked to play jazz, or liked to practice and stuff like that. And then, outside of school, I was also a part of Seattle JazzED, which is an outside of school jazz band program. And I got to meet one of my other mentors, Wayne Horvitz who's a pianist and composer. And it was really cool to be a part of Seattle JazzED, because there was also more women in a lot of their programs. So that was really cool to be around other women, and also sort of get to expose the different types of music like, you know, music that's like just been written recently, or, yeah, and then now I'm in my senior year at Temple University, studying jazz performance. I play trumpet. And now I'm living in Philly. And I really like it. And yeah, I've gotten to study with Terell Stafford and Joe Magnarelli, predominantly. And that's been really amazing. And getting to be around the Philly jazz scene has been really cool. Like, there's so many jam sessions and like, musicians working on different types of music and projects. And I also think, like not originally being from here, coming from Seattle, like coming from so far away. I feel like people in Seattle always talk about like, oh, like people in New York sound like this. There are people in Philly sound like this. And I always used to be like, oh, like, That's sounds like folklore, like, that's not a real thing. But I do think there is a Philly sound, and especially Philly drummers. And I think that's been really awesome to be around.

Ashley Killam 3:14

That's so cool. You've gotten those opportunities to explore. And I think it's so important. Carrie and I have heard this a bunch in a lot of the interviews, the importance of just having, like, you know, you said, being able to study with women, and like having that opportunity, you know, it can really shape you as a as a player and as a person. And as a as an educator, when you have that influence coming into your life. I also, I think it's really important to I know, not everyone can do this. But as someone who at least like jumped a couple of states for school, just getting out of the bubble that you were in for, you know, the first like, 16-17 years of your life is so important.

Bell Thompson 3:52

Yeah, I think that's been really cool to me, just people like completely different from where I'm from. Yeah. And then also speaking of female teachers, like, well, I've been a part of the Women in Jazz Organization's mentor program. So I started college, the year Roxy Coss started the program. So I've done it all four years. Which is kind of, it's kind of cool. So now, but now I have all these really cool women mentors that I like, can talk to and hang out with. And that's been really amazing, too. Yeah

Ashley Killam 4:22

No, that's awesome. Because and you as a younger musician, too, like you're in this space of like, you have a bunch of mentors, you know, older than you but then also like you are becoming that position of being a mentor for an upcoming generation of musicians, which is a really awesome space to be in.

Bell Thompson 4:42

Right

Ashley Killam 4:43

Both Carrie and I were super interested. You have been a soloist and a guest artist for a bunch of different groups, in different ensembles. And I'd love to hear a little bit about you know, how you formed those relationships and any advice you might have for younger musicians wanting to get into the scene of any sort of touring and soloing guest artist-ing.

Bell Thompson 5:08

Yeah. Um, let me think, because I didn't I mean, that was Yeah, most of that was pre COVID. I would say most of how I got those opportunities was through sort of upkeeping relationships with my teachers like after I had finished, whatever it was where they were teaching me I just, but like, so when I got to play with the Seattle Repertory Jazz Orchestra, that was a really cool opportunity. Oh, what's her name? I think Dee Daniels was like, she was like the number one, you know, she was like the star vocal guest artist. Um, and then my high school, jazz band teacher, Clarence A. Cox recommended me to go play with them. And they had some different graduating high schoolers go play, although he Yeah, put me in touch with those people. That was really cool. And I mean, now like, me and him are still friends. And I'll see him sometimes over the summer. And it's, you know, it's very sweet. I think, yeah, when I've also grown to be a guest artist, it's all I think it's all been through teachers, or like my other teacher, who taught me in middle school, Kelly Clingan, she, we've just been friends, you know, since then. So then she hired me to come teach at this jazz workshop, she was teaching at. I guess the only other one I can think of that is kind of an interesting story. So like, when I so my first band I ever had, that was like, my band was, I think I was a sophomore in high school, maybe, um, and I met these three other women at at Seattle jazzED, it's outside of school, I think at a camp, maybe I'd never played in like a small jazz group before, really. But I was like, this seems like something I should do. Or try to figure out how to do so I texted them. And I was like, hey, like, do you want to play some music together, like, I think it'd be really fun to have a band, like, I don't totally know how to have a band. But this seems like it could be fun. And they were all great. They were like, sure, like, and then every weekend for like a while, we would just play, like, because we had all really never been in a band before. So we would just, like open a real book and play some tunes, like try to figure out how to play them and try to, you know, might remember different songs. And so we had this group going for a couple of years. Um, and I think being an all female group, and so young, and like we were really trying to play to, I don't know, I feel like we were always trying to do gigs. Like, we were really trying to make it obvious that we were ready to play our songs. Then we got to play as a group we like sat in with the Seattle Women's Jazz Orchestra, which was a really cool experience. Yeah, I think, I think I knew some of the women in that group, just from being around or they had taught me a little bit. But that was a really cool experience, too. So I guess my only advice is like staying in touch with your teachers, or just like people who you, you know, people who you admire, and even just being like, I like sometimes I'll just send an email and be like, hey, like, I know, I haven't seen you in a long time. Like, here's sort of what I've been up to just really short, like, I just want to say hi, like, no pressure, if you're busy . But no, it's fun when everyone responds, um, and yeah, sort of, I'm keeping the relationships. And also, I think, I think starting your own group, or just like being willing to try things, even if you don't totally know how to do them, I think was important for that, too.

Ashley Killam 8:33

Definitely. The connections has been huge, because as we you know, everyone in the music world, though, the older I get in the music world, the more I realize how true this is, but the world just keeps getting smaller. And it's all about the connections you have. And like, I've had people just ask, you know, if I know any composers that write this type of music, or if I have any connections to like this school, and it's like, yeah, I'll do an introduction emails and get you in touch with other people. And, you know, just being able to help each other out is so important. And that's so cool that just all of the opportunities that you and your friends have had. And yeah, just being willing to start things because what's the worst that happens? It doesn't... It maybe leads to other pathways and opens other doors. Are you playing or leading any bands in the Philly area? Are you just playing and in freelancing? What do you like, I know you're in school, obviously. So I'm sure it's a lot of school groups.

Bell Thompson 8:58

Yeah. Yeah, I played a lot of school groups. Um, I'm right now I'm working on like a set of all original music. So I'm hoping to be able to go play that more soon. But I'm getting it all prepared for my senior recital. It's coming up. That's sort of the big, the big thing going on.

Ashley Killam 9:40

Oh, that's awesome. That'll be a wonderful really, really cool. You know, you did a recent study on gender in jazz, we'd love to hear about your research.

Bell Thompson 10:05

Yeah. Well, I decided to do a project, looking at the experience of young women in jazz education programs, because basically my short explanation of the issue that, you know, I could explain all day, but a really short version is like in middle school jazz bands, a lot of places, it's usually about half wom- half women. And then by high school, it's usually only around 20%. And then in college, it's like real you really, like, there's only gonna be like a couple women, like if you're in like a lucky situation. And so now, I don't know, I started, sort of, in my experience, I've, I've seen, I know, I've lived through seeing this. And I was like, Man, this is like, kind of a wild problem that's still going on. And also, when I've read about this issue, or when I started doing research, about maybe doing a project, I noticed that none of the existing research or things people have written have direct input from young women themselves who are in the programs. And I was like, that could be a really interesting thing to look into. So I did a qualitative research study, where I interviewed 16 young women who play instruments in high school jazz programs, from across the US and Canada. So I did this. And I started in 2020, like, right when the pandemic started, like March of 2020. I think I did the interviews in July of 2020. Yeah, so it was all like, deeply on Zoom. And I put out this, like flyer on Instagram, and I was like, Hey, I'm looking for people of this age group that play in high school jazz band, currently to, like, email me, and I'd love to interview you. So then I did these open ended interviews on Zoom, where I really just wanted to hear what they had to say in their own words. And like, I really just wanted to make sure I, yeah, I really captured it in their voice and their perspective. So I started out with my opening question being, just tell me about your experience playing music. That was just the first one, they could talk about whatever they wanted. And they were all about an hour. And then so from doing this with 16 young women who play um, it was interesting that even though I left the interview, so open ended, they all talked, most of them, I think, like 15 out of 16, or something talked about super similar things in a super similar order, and phrasing, and they're all from different regions. Yeah, well, here are some of the things that talked about. Um, so they all first talked about how much they love being in jazz band, and how much they love jazz music, and being a part of being part of a community of friends and their peers. And they also talked about it as they love being a part of band culture. But something I thought was really interesting was, after saying all of this, like they talk, they would also talk about how the culture of jazz band is problematic and tricky to navigate. And more about that is sort of like, they all describe it as they're sort of a conflict between the musical dimension of jazz band and the social dimension of jazz band, and a social dimension of jazz band feels really hard to navigate. And so what makes band culture so difficult to, to navigate is that it feels really socially isolating to just be like, the only girl in jazz band or be one of like, so few. And a lot of them talked about being treated as less significant by their peers or being treated different. And also being judged or just being judged before they even get to play for being women. Um, and, and how like all of this is just like an accepted part of how jazz band in high school is like, no one bats an eye. No one like says anything. This is just how it always is. Yeah. And basically, they all talked about that and all the interviews, and then the effectiveness on the young women in jazz band is like it just like, it doesn't feel like a big cultural problem. Like it just feels like Oh, I'm not good enough, or I don't belong in jazz band. And so it just ends up feeling like a personal failing. And this is all reinforced by like, Yeah, this is just accepted about how jazz band is gonna be. Yeah, so I thought that was really interesting. And then like, from my perspective is like the person asking questions, and researching what I thought was the most interesting was that, like, when I would ask people questions about doing research projects, everyone was like, oh, like interviewing kids is gonna be so hard, like, no one's gonna want to talk like you're gonna really have to pry, but they all like really were so excited to talk and they were like, wow, like, I can say anything like, like you really want I don't know, they were like, wow, like, no one's ever asked me before and I was like, wow, that's like really I mean, that's, to me that's like the biggest observation.

Ashley Killam 15:05

Yeah, it's really fascinating. I remember when I was starting a bunch of this research, I was reading a dissertation. Maybe maybe you've experienced or you've you've heard of this or not, but Dana Reason Myers, she's got her dissertation is on female jazz improvisers. And in her dissertation, she goes through some of like the major jazz journals and counts how many times they feature female jazz improvisers. And it's roughly 2% Out of these, like jazz journals that had been around for like, 70-80 years. And she coined the term the "myth of absence", where like, if you don't see, you know, a marginalized group doing whatever thing it is, then they're not doing that, which we obviously know, is not the case. And I'd never really thought about the retention in jazz band, and I remember experiencing it, and looking back at it now. It's, that is really interesting to see. But yeah, no one ever asks, or it because there's so many, I'm sure that like educators could do to, you know, really, like confront this lack of retention across like the middle school to high school and the high school that to collegiate levels.

Bell Thompson 16:24

Yeah, but I think like, yeah, what you're saying how, like, you don't even think about it's like, yeah, well, no one ever thinks about it, which is like, the craziest part. Because that's like, the first thing you could, I don't know, you know, it's like, this is just accepted, or, like, so accepted. Like, why even think about it?

Ashley Killam 16:41

Yeah. Or it's just like, not considered. And once you think of it, then it's like, oh, yeah, I'm gonna get angry. Because, like, how has it been? So like, it's been so ingrained in our systems, and the way we're raised that, like, oh, I don't need to think about it, or, you know, if it does come up, it's like one of those fleeting thoughts that are like, Oh, but it doesn't actually matter. When like, really, that is a big problem that matters. I feel like this, all of this research that you've started, like, oh, my gosh, this could stem a whole bunch more, you know, in depth. You know, I would not be surprised if the results on just the overall opinions. Like if you bring in more people than just the 16 I feel like it would continue to be very similar across the board. Yeah, yeah. I'm gonna, like, let this simmer for the rest of the day. That is really, really interesting. I'm glad you, you know, you had the opportunity to get started in this and at least in a little way, like enlightened and provide a space for the young women to you know, share their stories and give their experiences. And then our final question, my final question for you today. We ask all of our podcast guests, I can't speak it as a Friday afternoon. What's on your music stand this week? And how are you diversifying your stand? Whether that's like physical music stand or more metaphorical music stand.

Bell Thompson 18:05

No, that's good. Oh, well, this is last week, I got to go play at the Women in Jazz Organization's fundraiser in New York where Allegra Levy, she is one of the Yeah, she's like one of the people who makes WIJO work. She organized this whole concert where a bunch of us who have got to be in the program, basically got to bring in a piece of ours, or a piece written by women, by a woman. And, yeah, I'm performing at this little concert in Brooklyn. And that was really awesome. And that was really cool to get to. I mean, I got to play one of my songs, which is, of course, really exciting. But it was really cool getting to play like, all these other people's music they had written or just getting to listen to it. I thought that was a really cool and powerful experience. Yeah. And but now, I guess, no, I just Well, I've really been shedding for my senior recital, which is all music I wrote, which feels kind of crazy. Um, but it is sort of interesting, like taking on the challenge of like, okay, I just take this music I wrote as seriously, as, you know, like, historically important music and I'm gonna practice it. But that's been really cool. Yeah, that's mostly what I've been up to.

Ashley Killam 19:24

That's great. And that gives you like, an opportunity to, you know, like, put on another hat because I bet it feels a little different going about prepping for a recital when it's your music versus when it's someone else's.

Bell Thompson 19:37

Definitely.

Ashley Killam 19:38

Yeah, it gives you like different lenses to look at the same piece, which is kind of cool. Well, wonderful. Thank you so much. This is a great little insight. Yeah, it

Bell Thompson 19:48

Yeah it was really nice to meet you.

Carrie Blosser 19:50

Thank you for listening to Diversify the Stand. To support us and our projects. Visit our website at diversifythestand.org.

Ashley Killam 19:57

And a huge shout out to Eris DeJarnett who wrote the intro and outro music. The piece that we've been playing is Bored Games for two trumpets and fixed media. Links to their website are in the podcast description.

Carrie Blosser 20:08

And as always, we asked our guests what's on your stand?