Episode 11 - Dr. Brendan Ige
Episode 11 features Dr. Brendan Ige, a performer, educator, composer, and founder of the Tuba-Euphonium Social Justice Initiative. We talk with Brendan about his music, TESJI, and a whole bunch of activism.
To learn more about Brendan and all of the organizations he recommended, check out the links below!
Brendan Ige - Website
Tuba-Euphonium Social Justice Initiative (TESJI)
Men Wearing Dresses - Facebook
Men Wearing Dresses album, Starlust
Daryl Davis’s TED Talk - “Klan We Talk?”
Full Transcript
Carrie Blosser 0:01
Welcome to Diversify the Stand, the resource centered around listening, learning and promoting diverse musical voices in music, through our podcast, website, commissioning projects, and more. I'm Carrie Blosser.
Ashley Killam 0:15
And I'm Ashley Killam. Join us on our journey as we speak with composers, creators, performers, historians, and music educators about the topics important to them, and musics betterment.
Our next guest is a performer, educator, composer, contemporary music promoter and the founder of the Tuba-Euphonium Social Justice Initiative, and just a super cool person in general. We are so excited to welcome Brendon Ige today to talk with us.
Brendan Ige 0:50
Yeah, thanks so much for having me here. I'm excited to kind of go through the questions and hopefully say something good.
Carrie Blosser 1:01
It will definitely be good. We first wanted to talk a little bit about the Tuba-Euphonium Social Justice Initiative that you recently started over the past few months.
Brendan Ige 1:15
Yeah, it's been a, it's been quite a rapid growth in terms of the organization, we've had a lot of people to help. I'll kind of go through just a few of the projects and a few of the future projects some. Right now some things we're working on, we have a series we're trying to get off the ground called Music and Conversations. There'll be about three to four episodes, depending on budget per, per year. Our first one is going to feature Jon Sass. Heather Ewer, who teaches in New York City, has kind of been a big part in putting all of that together. And we try to have feature artists or composers, etc. and have them talk about their music and then have them have conversations of how social justice or inequities have influenced them. One interesting kind of part of the episode was when we asked Jon Sass his thoughts on differences between racism in America and racism in Vienna, where he's based, and I thought his answer was really interesting, intriguing and I'm excited to kind of put that out there. It's been kind of fun. We have a kind of a audio visual designer, putting it all together. And then I, along with john Bayless, and a friend James Long record. Now James is not on those recordings, it was me and John Bayless. It was in the same session that James was there, recorded the theme music for the opening and closing so there's going to be some music there. And we hope it's a little, it looks really nice, and it's something people might might enjoy watching and listening to.
Something we've done this year, and our continuing kind of annually as a commissioning project. You know, just, I guess, like diversifying the stand, you know, in terms of finding underrepresented composers and having them write something that's also accessible to that, that even students could play, and includes both the tuba and euphonium, sometimes euphonium gets the shorter end of the stick per se. And in a lot of endeavors. This year, we had Katahj Copely do it and he wrote a wonderful trio for piano, tuba, and euphonium. And Matt Kundler kind of leads that project. And we're looking to do it again this coming year and I think Fritz Kaenzig, has expressed a lot of interest in funding most, or all of that he is a emeritus professor at University of Michigan. So we're really excited to get this going annually.
Something more in the works, but already has some progress is our resource committee, we're hoping to take transcriptions of maybe some world music. So folks can play some world music, maybe even some underrepresented composers from older eras of music that are not contemporary. And we're trying to also in of this resource promote underrepresented contemporary composers who submit and we'll kind of feature them on the, on the pages that we have. And the last thing is we're just trying to kind of provide some info like just linked together a bunch of resources maybe for teachers or just people looking to kind of learn or get some more information about about those. Those things. There may even be be room enough that to put some some information that either of you have compiled.
So future things were. Oh, the last thing before I forget that we've already done Genevieve Clarkson and her committee have done such a wonderful job of making a newsletter, just with a bunch of articles talking about underrepresented composers and we're kind of slated in a lot of ways to have an article in every ITEA journal not under so much the guise of TESJI but just just having it there, is it's kind of a great thing so we'll kind of take some of what we do in our newsletter and put it there.
Future things we're looking at possibly a mentoring program and where we talk about navigating a career as someone under represented, there are certain things that you, I don't know, I think there are important things that could really help some folk and I think another big part of this program might be how to be an activist without getting in a lot of trouble. I think a lot of there are a number of my activist friends who have lost a great deal of opportunity, not because of their activism but the way they went about it or just in the battles that they chose to fight and how they chose to engage, you know, just because you're right when you're under represented, you don't get to just be right and not have consequences, unfortunately. Unfortunately. I'll never be one to tone police someone's anger. I'll always let an activist do the activism that they think is justified, but if you are concerned with career opportunity and all those things, I think there's a lot to that that that could be offered from a group like TESJI.
The big kind of future thing we're looking to is generating enough monetary support that we can put on a festival and the way that we've kind of dreamed of it is we'll have you know underrepresented performers, composers, different styles of music, such as you know brass band like or things like that, maybe some jazz, and just having this kind of venue where there's a food truck and maybe we can make it so that there's like accessibility where people who aren't just brass players might come and think this thing is really cool and we're showing the greater public representation. That would be super super cool if we could end up there, that's kind of our long term vision for all of this.
Ashley Killam 7:38
Well Carrie and I would go. We'd go to the TESJI conference. Kind of a follow up to that, when TESJI started forming, it was formed, was it formed based on just conversations in the tuba-euphonium community or lack thereof, or was it just kind of a bunch of really cool people that had the same sort of vision on getting together to make some change?
Brendan Ige 8:06
TESJI, in my opinion, I mean well ultimately, it stemmed from conflict with a particular person and it was almost an accident. One thing I think I've said in a in a in a previous interview, I've said it to many people whenever they ask inevitably how is it formed is I just try to do, try to do the next right thing. Like, it's like a Frozen 2 quote from like the rock people, like I just tried to do the next right thing and then it turned into that because after that conflict people approached me and said you should use some of this momentum to do something that's going to create lasting change. What's really difficult in of activism is sometimes it's really based on just like the emotions you feel and what came out in the media, in that moment. And with an organization, it's it's less about like anger or a quick or a spark you need that spark of conflict but then you need that organization, so it's this like relentless thing. There's something to be said about something that's relentless and just doesn't stop moving and so I was pushed to kind of form this organization, almost against my will, but then it just seemed like, well, I asked other people to do it. I was like I'll help, but nobody really wanted to take that mantle, I guess, and so the next right thing seemed to be to do it because if I didn't then it seemed like it would be just running away or something, or not doing the next right thing so that's kind of how it formed and then we got people together, which kind of leads into the next question, I think?
Carrie Blosser 10:05
Yes, yes, it does. We would love to talk to you a little bit about how you built this, there's a support team that's in place to have has for TESJI. And I would love to talk about, like some of the conversations y'all are having, as, as you're building momentum, and as things started, and like how you built your team of people to kind of help bring this group together?
Brendan Ige 10:28
Yeah, so honestly, because, you know, there wasn't, I've never considered myself much of like, the person with the plan, you know, but next thing you know, I was starting this organization. So I just asked some people that I knew, and I really admire their work ethic and thought they could bring something concrete that I knew, but a lot of it was asking random people that I didn't know, that just seemed to have activist inclination, that I see and participate in conversations, and just seeing who would respond. And of course, not everybody could do the work we were looking for. But we eventually ended up with a team. And I'd like to take some time to kind of talk about these members.
Jazzie Pigott is our Vice President. She's taking a major role in kind of just educating me on certain things and educating the group on certain things and kind of helping just to form the ideologies and, and how we sort of conduct ourselves. Akshat Jain is the treasurer. He actually is the one who did all the work, in terms of getting our account set up, etc, and filling out all that paperwork, doing the research he's looking into, right now finding Fiscal Sponsorship, so we can offer deductions so we can keep the revenue coming in and going out. Evan Zegiel is our secretary, he sets up all the meetings, does all the minutes, and he kind of is just like, the eye for aesthetic, he just like looks at everything and just makes sure, makes sure that they're edited right or just, things generally go through him before they go out. Heather Ewer is our Director of Outreach. So what Director of Outreach does is kind of, is in charge is vested with talking to individuals kind of reaches out to individuals, like individual college professors. Hope Aria is our Resource Manager and she is kind of in charge of what I referred to the Resource Committee, and just making sure that we get all of those things together. And Genevieve Clarkson is our Director of Public Relations. She's working on our website and streamlining. She's really trying to create a process by which we have gears in a system and we all just do that thing. And kind of, we all know exactly what we're supposed to do so we're trying to get those things kind of set up.
As far as like the conversations, we were having our initial conversations were the hardest, because we started out as a page, not a page, a group. We just, because of the conflict and because there was so much attention on it, we thought we might just create a group and get people invited, so that we could get the word out when we need to. But we had to figure out how to mod the page. And this is really important. I see a lot of activist groups, they call themselves activist groups but because they don't mod well, it becomes something way different. Like when they allow humor in their page, or things like 'I hope so and so catches COVID,' And because they're a problematic individual, these posts are allowed to stand or like humor can be making fun of people, it gets harder to mod or your group is not a group that calls people in. It's just a group that calls people out. And I don't, I don't know how effective that activism is to be honest, it can be effective if you go out there and create real conflict and then capitalize, but learning how to mod that page was a really interesting set of conversations to have, knowing that we want it to be a professional looking nonprofit organization that tries to build unity while taking a stand against injustice, injustices. The conversations after that were more how do we make this work? And then who do we need? And what do they need to do so that one person isn't taxed? So those were kind of just like the conversations that we had up to the up to the formation.
Ashley Killam 15:28
So we had seen recently, recently on social media, there was someone in music that was making some controversial comments, and seeing this person's, you know, comment section, there are a lot of people that you know, had all of the the pitchforks right away. And Carrie and I saw a comment you made on their post, just offering to have a conversation, and not being, not putting them down at all, just saying that your space was open, that you'd be willing to talk. And so we just wanted to hear your thoughts, kind of on the ideas you have around social justice and activism through these conversations, not necessarily, you know, targeting someone in a bad way, but being willing to keep an open space. And how do you keep such a level head when a lot of people go about this kind of very emotion-heavy.
Brendan Ige 16:25
So these conversations, I think are the, might be the most important part to activism, and it kind of goes back to calling people in and not out. And one person I kind of would like to highlight is someone by the name of Daryl Davis. And he said he's a black musician, actually and he went, and you can watch his videos, I think he might even have a TED talk. He went, this black man, and befriended like, grand wizards, or whatever stupid name they have, you know, how can you take anyone calling himself a Grand Wizard seriously? it's like the dumbest thing I've ever heard. But he went and he befriended these members, high ranking members of the KKK, and he became their friends. He had lunch with them. And what he realized is like, you know, it's kind of like that, like Star Wars quote, like, fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate leads to suffering, it was kind of like that. And he convinced, like 200 KKK members to hang up their ropes, just by being their friend and showing them that someone kind of existed and was willing to be their friends. I never intended to be an activist. And it's a really strange thing, and, but the conversations just kind of led to it and sometimes it led to conflict. But I think like, violence and calling people out is generally gratuitous, it's a, unless it's for the greater good, and you and that you can capitalize change from this conflict.
So these conversations are the most important thing, if you have the, the emotional space to have them, and you're able to do it, that's your best bet. Or, you know, for some folks like what I tell all my white friends is your place is actually, find your racist uncle, or your bigoted uncle, and talk to them. Just have a conversation, you know, bring out the Bud Light, and just like, have a conversation and see where that goes. That you know, that will never be my place because I don't, I don't have a white bigoted Uncle, you know, they don't exist for me. But, you know, one thing I think about activism is that we should all learn we all need to pick our lane. So if activism is a war on something, like a war on racism, or a war on etc., on sexism, on homophobia, transphobia. Everybody has a lane. And you know, in war, there are medics, there are people who just sit in the tower, broadcasting signal, and making sure communication is good. I think a lot of white people have roles as medics or as people making sure communication is good. And I think a lot of people need to respect that lane. And they need to know what their lane is though. They need to know where they're, they're best suited. As activists, I hope one day we can learn to respect each other's lanes.
It's almost like Dungeons and Dragons classes. You would never ask the wizard to just go duking it out in melee combat, fist to fist, because one hit and they're dead from that battle axe. And you should just respect that, like, when it really matters, the wizard has a Magic Missile that will not miss and you roll two D4. So you're at least doing two damage even at level one. And it could be a really great thing. And nobody has a problem respecting people's lanes in Dungeons and Dragons, you've never asked the healer to do ridiculous things because they need to heal the party. And everybody's really glad that they're, they're doing that, and I hope we can, we can kind of get to that point. And it's these conversations that, that bring those things out and just trying to be encouraging. So, yeah, it's, it's been the most important part of my activism, you know, and I do want to offer one, the flip side, there are some activists though, based on systemic things, and systemic racism, systemic sexism, etc, etc, all these glass ceilings and poverty, maybe their best activism is burning a target. That might be the only, the the most efficient way for someone who might not have the education or financial means to do the things that we're doing, to do their activism. And we should respect their lane too, you know. Everybody that has to do the activism that they're, they're called to do. And, and, and, you know, finding that respect and finding a way to bring the activists together, that's the hardest part, you know, the right. Often they tend to unite, I feel through fear and hate. So a lot of their ideology revolves around fear of like, it may be like fear of the outside, fear of immigration, people taking your jobs, fear of the wrath of God. Fear. There's so much fear and hate there. And it's so easy to unite through hate because there's only one way to hate something. There's only one way to hate something. That's why it's so hard to be a more leftist activist, because there's an infinite amount of ways to love. And we have to learn and and that's what leftists I think, generally try to unite through love, and then they fight about, oh, you're not loving the way that I think you should. If you really love someone, you should fight for them. But that's not necessarily true. Some people might think if you really love someone, you would support them and accept them. Others might think if you really love someone, you'd ask the tough questions. Others might think if you really love someone, you'd give them the freedom to do what they want and even mess up. And there are so many ways to love and that's what we fight about. And so there's a lot of just maybe disenfranchisement in leftist communities. Where we can't, because we disagree with the love that's being shown, we'll fight against it.
Carrie Blosser 23:22
Here is Space Jam. From Brendon Ige's album Starlust, released in January of 2021. This piece has muted flugabone, a vamp-style track with old-school style shedding and as the program notes say, this track throws hands, it's a Space Jam.
Your final question here with your Diversify the Stand interview, and it's question that we're asking everyone as their final final question. And it is, what is on your music stand this week and how are you diversifying your stand?
Brendan Ige 28:00
Yeah, you know one thing that I've been lucky just in terms of who I've run into and the environments that I've been in, I've had a, I feel a good mix of representation in of the solo works that I've chosen to do, from both contemporary and dead composers. In my commissions I think it's, it's pretty, it's pretty well split. And so it hasn't, diversifying the stand hasn't been something that I've ever had to think of and I'm grateful that experiences led me to that if I didn't have a diverse environment, I wouldn't be able to ask those people to write a piece or I wouldn't think to, oh, we should have some women or people of color on this program. It was something that was fairly natural.
One thing I've been trying to do to diversify my stand though, is learn to improvise. You know, I've got this flugabone, it's, it's pink. And the bell is the bell is pink with glitter, and it's pink polka dotted and then the slides are like, neon pink. And it's like, I mean, it's a party horn, you know, and, you know, it's perfect to just kind of shred on like, it looks like it's for shredding. Like, that's what it looks like you're supposed to do. And I feel like to consider your stand really diverse, there has to be other styles. If you're constantly reading, you might not be as diverse even if you have representation on your stand. So that's something I've kind of made a pact I'm going to really study that music and try to try to learn to improvise in various styles. One area I'm problematic though, is my etude book choices and my method book choices. I was thinking I want to put more thought into that. But it's very difficult because usually when you commission someone, you commission a solo. So maybe that's something, oh, maybe the next TESJI commission project are two etude books, one for tuba, one for euphonium, that address all the same pedagogical concerns, and in different ways from someone who is underrepresented. That would be kind of cool. That's just, I mean, like, you can get really far on by whatever the mainstream lyrical book is. So for us, it's Rochut, Arban, and whatever your favorite like, we're gonna play scales, so like Kopprasch, or Turrell, or whatever your favorite. It could, you know, you could get fancy you could do like Charlier, whatever. You're more like meatier, meatier etude book, all you need is three though. And and why not teach the ones that you know that you're going to be able to pick up your horn at any time in sight read for your students. Why not pick what you're familiar with? But that's one area. I'm thinking hard.
Carrie Blosser 31:15
Oh, cool. Well, thank you, Brendan, so much for joining us.
Brendan 31:18
Yeah, this was really great. I look forward to kind of seeing the product of that and
Carrie Blosser 31:24
We'll put all the links that you sent us. We will put the links for you, TESJI, and everything else that you cited today in the links in the podcast description.
Ashley Killam 31:38
Thank you so much for listening to Diversify the Stand. I am Ashley.
Cassie Ruiz 31:43
And I'm Carrie. If you'd like to support us at our projects, check out our Patreon www.patreon.com/diversify_the_stand. Also, the link is in our podcast description.
Ashley Killam 31:58
And a huge thank you to Trevor Weston and Whitney George, for allowing us to use their compositions in our podcast. The musical introduction is Trevor's trumpet duet Fanfare for Changes and the ending music is Whitney's Incantations for trumpet and piano. Both composers websites are also listed in the description.
Carrie Blosser 32:17
Until next time, what's on your stand?